See:

wirelessoxford dot org

...by the way.

Great idea, Jock. Something positive. Much better than your tacit support for drug dealers etc.

Does that mean I can play my XBOX 360 for free??

Deidre Holes - this project is looking to provide network access to children at home (among others). A website providing the features you mention is a completely different, but complementary, project.

Alan Page wrote:
Great idea, Jock. Something positive. Much better than your tacit support for drug dealers etc.

Alan i bet you have had to call the police several times in your life to report that you had assualted yourself.

What a miserable bast*rd..........

Tom wrote:

Alan Page wrote: Great idea, Jock. Something positive. Much better than your tacit support for drug dealers etc.

Alan i bet you have had to call the police several times in your life to report that you had assualted yourself. What a miserable bast*rd..........

Tom ,

You should be ashamed of yourself.

Alan is not feeling himself these days.
(Which is unusual)!

Gordon Brown has upset him terribly. Nu Labour are the new Anti-Christ!

Everyone is a drug dealer/user or anti Immigration orientated.

I will adjust his medication and sexual desires appropriately.

Please bear with him for now!

Not literally of course!

Thank you for your co-operation.

Nurse Tess wrote:

Tom wrote:

Alan Page wrote: Great idea, Jock. Something positive. Much better than your tacit support for drug dealers etc.

Alan i bet you have had to call the police several times in your life to report that you had assualted yourself. What a miserable bast*rd..........

Tom , You should be ashamed of yourself. Alan is not feeling himself these days. (Which is unusual)! Gordon Brown has upset him terribly. Nu Labour are the new Anti-Christ! Everyone is a drug dealer/user or anti Immigration orientated. I will adjust his medication and sexual desires appropriately. Please bear with him for now! Not literally of course! Thank you for your co-operation.

Sorry Nurse Tess.


Shame on me for mocking a sick man.


Over and out.

"According to a survey, the main reason people don't have the Internet is because they can't afford it."

If they got a job and cut down on the drink and drugs then £15 a month may be afforadable

Alan, I'm sure you realize you misrepresent my position on drugs. I do not support drug dealers, except the ones that sell Draught Bass...:)

However the dealers are attracted to the illegal drugs market precisely because of prohibition and the massive porfit opportunity for the ones that can get away with it. As Milton Friedman I think it was said "prohibition is the biggest subsidy to organized crime".

Anyway, this is not about that, but about Wireless Oxford. Way back when I was on the council and the internet was but young I tried to get them to look into the idea of fiber to the door, but of course it's prohibitively expensive. With WiMax in particular we now have an opportunity to have similar bandwidth not just to your home but to anywhere you go in the city at a much smaller capital outlay. In a knowledge economy, which Oxford has been for what, eighht hundred years, our futures depend in my opinion on access to top notch communications access for all - as the article says, just as the roads or electricity network was last century.

I was very hesitant to go with the story in the paper to start with because we are at such an early stage. I've been lobbying for ages but only really got into action about 14 months ago when I wrote to the "movers and shakers" in the city's main employers and users of ICT and trade bodies and so on but nobody replied. Hamilton Trust got interested as a way of enabling guaranteed access for school children, and indeed the first public sector taker of the MK project has been schools based.

So really the details are very sketchy at the moment. We have some figures on capital cost and so on but have yet to do projected take-up models and so be able to suggest price ranges. But I would say that at the moment the idea would be, I hope, to enable basic access either for free or for an annual payment to register each wireless device you want to use. This would be perhaps speed throttled or time limited or something. Also it has been suggested that access to online facilities within the Oxford area itself could be free and then you would pay for access to facilities that required us to fund long distance bandwidth, so if the school or the county had a network based here that access could be free to kids whenever. And yes, Henry, that means you could play your XBOX against people anywhere within that wireless Oxford network for free but need a subscription (either via us or your regular broadband supplier potentially) to get out into the wider internet.

Anyway, lots of possibilities; I just felt that it was not something a local authority should or could really achieve - for a start there is usually a problem with competition rules if the state is involved somewhere. But it needs to be a commercial proposal, albeit one that ought to be wrapped up in a social enterprise whose purpose, and surplus, from some customers would go to the main purpose of ensuring that nobody goes without internet access because they can't afford it or because the commercial providers do not regard their area as a priority.

But it isn't *that* expensive for the whole city in capital terms and could very well be funded up front by the big ICT users in the city on an "invest to save" type basis.

Jock wrote:
Alan, I'm sure you realize you misrepresent my position on drugs. I do not support drug dealers, except the ones that sell Draught Bass...:) However the dealers are attracted to the illegal drugs market precisely because of prohibition and the massive porfit opportunity for the ones that can get away with it. As Milton Friedman I think it was said "prohibition is the biggest subsidy to organized crime". Anyway, this is not about that, but about Wireless Oxford. Way back when I was on the council and the internet was but young I tried to get them to look into the idea of fiber to the door, but of course it's prohibitively expensive. With WiMax in particular we now have an opportunity to have similar bandwidth not just to your home but to anywhere you go in the city at a much smaller capital outlay. In a knowledge economy, which Oxford has been for what, eighht hundred years, our futures depend in my opinion on access to top notch communications access for all - as the article says, just as the roads or electricity network was last century. I was very hesitant to go with the story in the paper to start with because we are at such an early stage. I've been lobbying for ages but only really got into action about 14 months ago when I wrote to the "movers and shakers" in the city's main employers and users of ICT and trade bodies and so on but nobody replied. Hamilton Trust got interested as a way of enabling guaranteed access for school children, and indeed the first public sector taker of the MK project has been schools based. So really the details are very sketchy at the moment. We have some figures on capital cost and so on but have yet to do projected take-up models and so be able to suggest price ranges. But I would say that at the moment the idea would be, I hope, to enable basic access either for free or for an annual payment to register each wireless device you want to use. This would be perhaps speed throttled or time limited or something. Also it has been suggested that access to online facilities within the Oxford area itself could be free and then you would pay for access to facilities that required us to fund long distance bandwidth, so if the school or the county had a network based here that access could be free to kids whenever. And yes, Henry, that means you could play your XBOX against people anywhere within that wireless Oxford network for free but need a subscription (either via us or your regular broadband supplier potentially) to get out into the wider internet. Anyway, lots of possibilities; I just felt that it was not something a local authority should or could really achieve - for a start there is usually a problem with competition rules if the state is involved somewhere. But it needs to be a commercial proposal, albeit one that ought to be wrapped up in a social enterprise whose purpose, and surplus, from some customers would go to the main purpose of ensuring that nobody goes without internet access because they can't afford it or because the commercial providers do not regard their area as a priority. But it isn't *that* expensive for the whole city in capital terms and could very well be funded up front by the big ICT users in the city on an "invest to save" type basis.

Good for you Jock and thank you as a resident of Oxford (unlike Alan)for what you are trying to do.You are trying to improve the city for us all,unlike Alan who is trying to Mock it(and you) from .........Guilford...
....how weird....


Nurse Tess tells me he is not well.
Frankly i would be more surprised if he was felling well.............

"While Oxford is 'well wired', there are areas of relative deprivation within the city which are likely to be last on any commercial roll-out timetable."

Oxford is certainly not "well wired". When Greater Leys was built the cabling was run for miles to the Cowley Exchange - ok for Voice calls but hopeless for Broadband. Much of the estate is limited to a half meg connection.

BT Wholesale/Openworld, in their role as infrastructure provider to my ISP, have already threatened to mark my landline as being "unsuitable for broadband" if they continue to have problems maintaining the service.

Deidre Holes,'Nuff said.

Jock wrote:
Alan, I'm sure you realize you misrepresent my position on drugs. I do not support drug dealers, except the ones that sell Draught Bass...:) However the dealers are attracted to the illegal drugs market precisely because of prohibition and the massive porfit opportunity for the ones that can get away with it. As Milton Friedman I think it was said "prohibition is the biggest subsidy to organized crime". Anyway, this is not about that, but about Wireless Oxford. Way back when I was on the council and the internet was but young I tried to get them to look into the idea of fiber to the door, but of course it's prohibitively expensive. With WiMax in particular we now have an opportunity to have similar bandwidth not just to your home but to anywhere you go in the city at a much smaller capital outlay. In a knowledge economy, which Oxford has been for what, eighht hundred years, our futures depend in my opinion on access to top notch communications access for all - as the article says, just as the roads or electricity network was last century. I was very hesitant to go with the story in the paper to start with because we are at such an early stage. I've been lobbying for ages but only really got into action about 14 months ago when I wrote to the "movers and shakers" in the city's main employers and users of ICT and trade bodies and so on but nobody replied. Hamilton Trust got interested as a way of enabling guaranteed access for school children, and indeed the first public sector taker of the MK project has been schools based. So really the details are very sketchy at the moment. We have some figures on capital cost and so on but have yet to do projected take-up models and so be able to suggest price ranges. But I would say that at the moment the idea would be, I hope, to enable basic access either for free or for an annual payment to register each wireless device you want to use. This would be perhaps speed throttled or time limited or something. Also it has been suggested that access to online facilities within the Oxford area itself could be free and then you would pay for access to facilities that required us to fund long distance bandwidth, so if the school or the county had a network based here that access could be free to kids whenever. And yes, Henry, that means you could play your XBOX against people anywhere within that wireless Oxford network for free but need a subscription (either via us or your regular broadband supplier potentially) to get out into the wider internet. Anyway, lots of possibilities; I just felt that it was not something a local authority should or could really achieve - for a start there is usually a problem with competition rules if the state is involved somewhere. But it needs to be a commercial proposal, albeit one that ought to be wrapped up in a social enterprise whose purpose, and surplus, from some customers would go to the main purpose of ensuring that nobody goes without internet access because they can't afford it or because the commercial providers do not regard their area as a priority. But it isn't *that* expensive for the whole city in capital terms and could very well be funded up front by the big ICT users in the city on an "invest to save" type basis.

Jock,
You know my position on those who argue that "Prohibition doesn't work". If it doesn't, then child pornography should also be legalised for exactly the same reasons.

I have very little time for monetarism and the profit before people views of Milton Friedman,or for the posturings of libertarians (civil or economic) in general. They only serve to open new markets to benefit the wealthy at the expense of the poor.

As I say this is something I wholeheartedly support. So keep going in this direction.

Tom wrote:

Jock wrote: Alan, I'm sure you realize you misrepresent my position on drugs. I do not support drug dealers, except the ones that sell Draught Bass...:) However the dealers are attracted to the illegal drugs market precisely because of prohibition and the massive porfit opportunity for the ones that can get away with it. As Milton Friedman I think it was said "prohibition is the biggest subsidy to organized crime". Anyway, this is not about that, but about Wireless Oxford. Way back when I was on the council and the internet was but young I tried to get them to look into the idea of fiber to the door, but of course it's prohibitively expensive. With WiMax in particular we now have an opportunity to have similar bandwidth not just to your home but to anywhere you go in the city at a much smaller capital outlay. In a knowledge economy, which Oxford has been for what, eighht hundred years, our futures depend in my opinion on access to top notch communications access for all - as the article says, just as the roads or electricity network was last century. I was very hesitant to go with the story in the paper to start with because we are at such an early stage. I've been lobbying for ages but only really got into action about 14 months ago when I wrote to the "movers and shakers" in the city's main employers and users of ICT and trade bodies and so on but nobody replied. Hamilton Trust got interested as a way of enabling guaranteed access for school children, and indeed the first public sector taker of the MK project has been schools based. So really the details are very sketchy at the moment. We have some figures on capital cost and so on but have yet to do projected take-up models and so be able to suggest price ranges. But I would say that at the moment the idea would be, I hope, to enable basic access either for free or for an annual payment to register each wireless device you want to use. This would be perhaps speed throttled or time limited or something. Also it has been suggested that access to online facilities within the Oxford area itself could be free and then you would pay for access to facilities that required us to fund long distance bandwidth, so if the school or the county had a network based here that access could be free to kids whenever. And yes, Henry, that means you could play your XBOX against people anywhere within that wireless Oxford network for free but need a subscription (either via us or your regular broadband supplier potentially) to get out into the wider internet. Anyway, lots of possibilities; I just felt that it was not something a local authority should or could really achieve - for a start there is usually a problem with competition rules if the state is involved somewhere. But it needs to be a commercial proposal, albeit one that ought to be wrapped up in a social enterprise whose purpose, and surplus, from some customers would go to the main purpose of ensuring that nobody goes without internet access because they can't afford it or because the commercial providers do not regard their area as a priority. But it isn't *that* expensive for the whole city in capital terms and could very well be funded up front by the big ICT users in the city on an "invest to save" type basis.

Good for you Jock and thank you as a resident of Oxford (unlike Alan)for what you are trying to do.You are trying to improve the city for us all,unlike Alan who is trying to Mock it(and you) from .........Guilford... ....how weird.... Nurse Tess tells me he is not well. Frankly i would be more surprised if he was felling well.............

Er... hold on in there. Your the racist creep who talks about people on these estates being scum.

I would have thought you would be going on about "decent taxpayers money"etc.

The Far right eh? What a complete waste of space they.

Thank you Andrew - that confirms what I said. Oxford *is* well wired, in the sense that a bigger part of the population than almost anywhere else has access to some of the best connectivity in Britain through the universities and the fact that the city (often the central areas) is quite often chosen for pilots and so on, but that there are areas of relative deprivation which are always last on the commercial providers' list. Precisely what this project aims to change.

But just for my research, as it will make a difference to the potential take-up modelling, do you have NTL/Virgin on the Leys, say? Are you faced with both a BT monopoly and a hopeless BT connection?

So according to Alan page i am a "racist creep".

Interesting.......

Alan Page defines a racist as someone who mentions any issue due to unfair mass immigration in the UK.

Alan i could ,like you, just say nothing out of fear of being labeled a "racist".

I wish well to all of gods men and women on this planet,however i do not see that the U.K should be a dumping ground for those on the planet who are victims of economic failure,more often than not caused by their own governments greed and criminal deeds.


But that is the problem with Alan Page.

He has not travelled much and therefore thinks the whole world operates to British standards.



And finally i would like to repeat a classic from yesterday which sums up Alan......



Alan i bet you have had to call the police several times in your life to report that you had assualted yourself.

What a miserable bast*rd..........

Can I also point out (at least to Alan; it should be obvious to anyone with a brain) the gaping hole in his drugs/child pornography argument.

It's like arguing that because attempted suicide is no longer a crime, neither should be attempted murder.

While I'm not suggesting that taking drugs is entirely a victimless crime, the victims which are created by this industry - from those burgled or mugged by junkies desperate to get enough money to pay for their next fix, to the coca/opium farmers at the mercy of drugs barons - are not helped by prohibition. It just raises the price of drugs so that there is more junkie crime, and strengthens the position of drug barons.

Anyway, Page-inspired rant over - congratulations to Jock for this great initiative. It's nice to hear about people with the drive and vision to improve life in the community. Good luck.